DL on Wiki


I am a Darkstar
Ah, yeah... I'm too pessimistic to hit on it...  :-D
I also found some press articles on DL, Veljanov and Helium Vola in my personal archive, but didn't run through. This is my homework for tomorrow.


I am a Darkstar
deepesttottenham meinte:

Thanks, I've just noticed you posted the link for me :)

deepesttottenham meinte:
Hush, don't you understand this will be a chance to actually talk to them on a serious topic...

:-D : naughty:  :-D

And yet I thought we were actualy arguing about who DOESN'T HAVE TO do it  :-D

Thanks for the helpful info, Tapir.

Anyway, I found out that the goth magazines wrote about DL quite often even in the past, usually when they released a new album... but the only way how to lay hands on those magazines is to order them from the publisher I think...
All of my articles are about 20 Years of Electronic Avantgarde and the jubiläum connected to that (=some info about history, talking about their style, I think I even found one article a bit criticising the hassle around 20YoEA).


I am a Darkstar
yes yes talk to them we want ..... yes yes approval we seek

nice efforting Proxima...

Wonder why they wrote Stupid.??? isnt it regards to their critics.....??


I am a Darkstar
And yet I thought we were actualy arguing about who DOESN'T HAVE TO do it

I'm the one who started the topic in the first place, so this fact alone makes me deserve recognition  :cool:  :-D  :-D

As for you, you'll be the one to sign the collective email to AV with "Yours, Vita"  :-D : heart2: :-D

Colour-Ize Team

I am a Darkstar
Hi folks,

it's a great idea to improve the english wikipedia article. Thanks to all of you, who
will put time and work into creating a new and better english DL wiki. :)

If Colour-ize can help you in any way, we will do all we can.

your Colour-ize Team


I am a Darkstar
deepesttottenham meinte:
As for you, you'll be the one to sign the collective email to AV with "Yours, Vita"  :-D : heart2: :-D
Deja vu! Just today my friend told me if I ever were to write a fan-letter to DL I'd have to sign it like this!  :-D
Don't be affraid, we all humbly recognize you as the Mastermind  : heart2: :wink:(so that we have a scape-gout if something goes wrong :wink: ) Yes yes, let's blame it on the person who came with the idea, shall we, not on the poor thing that just has an unfortunate name XD. Not to mention I had it first. Mr. Veljanov copied it from my parents : smile2:.  

RaBBitFan meinte:
Wonder why they wrote Stupid.??? isnt it regards to their critics.....??
I was thinking about it too when I first heard it (OK, when I found the lyrics to understand it XD). It might be a good question to ask (if we were to ask questions), but then again, it'd be boring to know what exactly they meant by their lyrics (though it'd be helpful for school essays XD), I love to imagine things they could have meant or I just let the pictures it evocates float in my mind without really thinking hard about it. Not to mention that, well, not with stupid, but with other songs they could... not have meant anything in particular, you know, just having a sudden inspiration and writing what came to their mind. But I think it's a pity they don't talk about their inspiration for songwriting more, I read Mr. Horn talking about the composing and notes writing, but never about the lyrics. :cry:

Anyway, I'd have to re-read the article again with a dictionary, but I changed my opinion from "criticising" to "being a bit sarcastic". I admit I don't understand much the intro part because it's difficult (direct speech is way more simple to understand). But in this srticle is a whole bunch of private info about Mr. Horn, however, I wouldn't use it (=the private info, because there is also good information about Mr. Horn's music and DL time-management) for the wiki article. Not only it would be weird next to almost no info about Mr. Veljanov (except for their shared passion for talking about their daughters :-D), but also I don't think that it's really needed to write things like Mr. Horn's garden needs a gardener and his house has seen beter days too. Even though in Zillo it's presented as his own words (not my translation, the original German sentence of course XD).  


I am a Darkstar
members of the TDG  your efforts be praised... the mods sprinkles us with their blessings.... very good work on tracking the photo rights down....

Proxima  you of all members are to be hailed fully and forth right.... you have 6 exams and yet you contribute very viable information...  you and I must talk when you are free of exams about the angst of wanting to know the song meanings and not... I am with you all the way on that... however..... I do want to know what caused Ernst to write the lyrics to wunderbar....its very cryptic I feel....  ps please explain the Vita/AV thing  i am not in this mobius loop and would love to be :-D
Tapir thanks for the photo info.... and being you
Deeps  thank you for posting the thread in the correct area  and for your insight.. and work as well

and DD as well..for being DD and offering her excellent translation skills!!

you guys have no idea how rare DL is over here... even among the Goths....I swear I am the only person in portland OR that owns the 20 year avantgarde  cd that we had to weasle out of a local  record shop for a hefty sum....  the american ear for quality music is on a downward spiral. and I don't expect it to get better...... you guys are so very very lucky....  I am so taken with these people and their music that I seriously cant take anyone serious unless they appreciate their music as I can... its the DL litmus test :evil:

ok next order o bid ness

links  so Im sure the mods would allow us to link the forum info on the wiki bit  --I will ask them...

what about the other players in DL Ivee Lee and such?? can we find info about them  again photos?? how did they come to meet the boys wonder  ....I wonder

let me get the ok from the magazine quoting ernst about the moodyblues popgoth thing

I need help from the German sector of the project for translating a few you tube videos.... any takers??? PM me and I will send you the links.

Proxima when do you expect to have a little free time??  can we actually chat here?? that might shave off a few weeks of the project...

what say you all???

rabbit : heart2:


homework for you all

list of words you would use to describe the boys based on what you hear of their music  not personal  strictly subjective

an example .....is when I hear veganvenjghdf;kjga  -too lazy to spell it out-  I think Ernst has a wicked sense of humor
when Alex sing maybe I feel that he is selling hope with his voice... look the grass is green the sky is blue....all is good
this will help with the expansion of the descriptive process
: heart2: : heart2:


I am a Darkstar
My name and Alexander Veljanov is a weird coincidence. My name is VERY RARE. There are three ways how to write it in Czech (each one being a different name actually) and the form I have exists just 26 times in CR (we have more than 10 million people living here). It's written víta (long "i") and it means "life" in latin (so I always think it's so ironic when I was born 6.8.1990 = exactly 45 years after Hiroshima was turned to dust). So the thing is, that the word is normally used by educated people in expressions coming from latin as "life". And Mr. Veljanov, obviously knowing at least the basic latin vocabulary, wrote a song that is a part of Porta Macedonia CD and it is called "His Vita". Either his latin is not that good and "His Vita" actually refers the "Hís Víta" = "To/About/With This life" but written completely wrong since víta is nominativ/akuzativ/(ablativ when written as vítá) and singular while "his" is dativ and ablativ of plural. SO even though we all know that Lakaien-English is mysterious, I doubt that Veljanov-Latin would be this bad. Well, if his can refer to something else in latin, please let me know :-D. So the second option is that "His Vita" is "His life" or "His Vita" in case Macedonians have the name too (possible since they're from similar language group as we are and we know that Kasmodiah is a girl's name too). So now people all around keep making fun of me and the "To whom does Vita belong?" thing. Explaining also that signature "Yours Vita" :-D.
Wow, sorry I got so caught up in my egoism and linguistic talking *is sorry*.

As for the exams and still reading DL articles... I'm a lucky person. I found out that it usually doesn't matter how much I learn, I never get questions I can't answer. Well, not to mention some teachers don't read my tests anymore, they just write A XD. I suspect that the Czech language teacher is actually afraid to disagree with me : naughty:. And the last and most important thing is my insomnia. When you sleep around 4 hours a day, you have plenty of time : skully:. I should be free from Thursday evening when I come home from the lab (around 6 o'clock) to Sunday evening (I have some projects I need to do but it's not going to eat my whole weekend).

I fully understand the problems people not knowing DL cause *hugs*. The same here. I swear that all people who know about them around were infected by my pushiness (some accepted willingly, some were forced by "I'll learn to play The Promise/The Sacrifice if you learn lyrics for Wunderbar!"). But I think about 15% of goths here at least know who they are. But I doubt they listen to them since the goth scene here is... pitiable. A friend of mine who just decided to stop putting new articles on our website about old school goth rock wrote this: "I don't want to be associated with people who go to a concert not to dance, see the musician or listen to the music but to make new pics in the expensive corset and to play some super dark fetish divas." I guess the problem here is that when people finally started to catch up with the west scene, they got too enchanted by what is presented by German magazines and stopped seeing difference between dark undeground subculture as a whole and goth. Sorry, I'm just angry as an amateur sociology freak. However, don't forget that Lakaien are not music for everyone. Their music and lyrics are quite sophisticated and they mix plenty of styles together... e.g. my mum likes their acoustic shows and some songs from 20YofEA, but she hates the rest (actually at least 70% of the songs). I think that this fan-community is filled with a specific kind of people... (not feeling superior or anything XD) 

I agree that we should write about the other musicians too, including die Neue Philharmonie Frankfurt. The medieval instruments one and the violin one talk a lot in the Jeans and Music programm featured on youtube but I don't understand enough to write it down exactly T_T.

Do you think we need a consent to quote from the magazines and list them as sources? In CR you don't have to, but I don't know which country's law is valid for the wiki articles...

As for Rabbit's homework:
Mr. Veljanov: hot tempered, sarcastic, intelligent, liking to provoke and to show off, theatrical, thoughtful (especially because of the things on WFT) optimistic (the newer works), mysterious, bold
Mr. Horn: agree with the wicked humor! Especially in some songs when he makes his "why play just the keys when I can take a spoon and beat the strings inside to death!?" Then I would annul it by saying romantic. Then... perfectionist (I love the way Mr. Horn's lyrics match the music also with their euphony), intelligent, thoughtful (20YofEA)
It's difficult to guess since the songs are so different! That's what I love too, they have such an unique style and yet they can surprise the listeners with new and new experiments of an incredible quality.


I am a Darkstar
this is really interesting!
Here would come the subject of the mysterious meaning of his story of Latah -- you know this Run Run Vanguard song, don't you? -- if it wasn't for the vigilant moderators who don't tolerate offtopic  ;-) (As for me, I really like it when people write large and meaningful posts with a personal touch, even if they drift of the subject :) ).

Do you think we need a consent to quote from the magazines and list them as sources?
I don't know 100%, but it would be utterly illogical if we had to! 'Cause otherwise Wikipedia would have been a very small and humble website  :)...


I am a Darkstar
Dear ones... in america the land where legal lawsuits are out of control

yes we must get permission to use the article and /or we need to properly quote the source... its call APA format... I am very well versed in this as we had to use this format for our research papers in nursing school....  I will take care of this detail as it has been beaten into my persons and now is second nature to me....

as far as the off topic realm.... I agree there does seem to be a culture on the German side particularly for the mods to intervene Perhaps its a cultural issue  I understand that a mememe fest is always a possiblity on a forum like this however like Mme. Proxima stated... this site draws people of a particular nature... generally a nature that is not inclined to mememe.... plus this is the english speaking forum.... and I sure we have a different feel here than the German one :wink:

That being said... I fully endorse and will back up Proxima's post... there are so many things I have learned about language and its synchronistic collision of her name and the song name.... very appropo....

so in short no apology needed  :-D :-D :-D

ummm never knew this was the university of DL.... I get my learn on all time here....
So gald I came here!

excellent descriptive words proxima thank you

Also if you know of any one on the German side that would be interested lets invite them... who knows what perspective they may bring  I have invited  broze.. shes young and quirky plus has 1666+ post : naughty:

all my best


I am a Darkstar
or we need to properly quote the source..

Yes, sure, but in this case we don't have to ask for permission, do we?  :-o (Mind you Proxima, I'm not saying "we" do get a piece of the pie, I just don't know another way to put it grammatically  :-D)

Or do you mean that when you're writing a school thesis in the US, you have to contact every single living author in your bibliography??  :-o


I am a Darkstar
deepesttottenham meinte:
or we need to properly quote the source..
Yes, sure, but in this case we don't have to ask for permission, do we?
We don't have to ask for permission. We just must not change the excerpts and have to properly quote the source.
@ RaBBitFan: There is already one from the German side in here!  :-D
And concerning the youtube interview stuff: Please send the links to me. I can't promise, I can translate them, but I can decide if they're useful, I'm sure!  :-D
At last Rabbit's homework: I think "bizarre" is the most fitting expression for AV...  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D


I am a Darkstar
I'll try to remain silent about off topic in the future anyway (allright, not kept in the end of the post) so that I don't cause disturbance (and closing the thread) :angel:.
However, I hope that the problem is not talking about the thread's theme AND other stuff at the same time but changing the topic completely. So I hope that the little side talk doesn't offend anyone.

A bigger problem is that I need to send you the translation and even better, I need a German person to look at the sentences I couldn't get right (damned syntax) and yet if I understood the petty German law right I cannot post the bits of translation here because I don't have the consent to do so from the author of the article BUT I just need to consult it and such. So maybe you could all give me your e-mails and I'll send it to you and we keep it private and don't post the translation on a public site thus we don't violate the copyright because we're actually not publishing it? If the mods read this: No, I don't want to overcome the rules (I said I try to behave when outside of my country, even if it's virtual space :-D), but I try to find an intelligent solution. However, I think that it's really not something that someone would be offended by. Even if the author of the article found it here, he'd know it's just a 'work-version' and that he'll be properly stated and credited (as our dear Rabbit promised) in the article. But the mods actually made me so frightened about the copyrights (since there's the issue with publishing the translated articles from Czech - and the form of the consent of the acquaintance of mine who wrote them) that I'm trying to be extremely careful now : smile2:.

deepesttottenham meinte:
Here would come the subject of the mysterious meaning of his story of Latah -- you know this Run Run Vanguard song, don't you?

Um, I don't :|

Anyway, I have the first paragraph of one of the articles done (without two small thingies I'm unsure about, so I think I'll deal with the problem of getting the translation to you after it's all done and corrected by some nice German person. It should be easier in the end since Mr. Horn is talking more than the interviewer (with the weird syntax XD).

Ah, what about we published some statistics : naughty:?
The fave expression of DL texts: Make love (at least three times but maybe more)
The fave word of Mr. Horn: Unheimlich (the best english word would be... horrible I think? Like "It is horribly expensive, it takes a horrible amount of time and such)

And... one small small off topic since one small amateur designer and seamstress has had her aesthetic taste hurt: Why can Mr. Veljanov buy a suit that fits him perfectly (good length, copying the shape of the body, good length of the sleeves, the seams where they should be...) and Mr. Horn's one tends to hang on him a bit? At first I thought it was just because he usually lets it be open and loves to be photographed with hands in the pockets and such so that the jacket looks even less fitting but then it seemed to me that it's really just too big in the shoulder part and in the waist too, probably too wide sleeves as well (or is it just my imagination?). Not to mention I'd tear him to pieces if he got into my hands (sorry, hardcore fans  : heart2: :-D) for combining T- shirt with a black, rather evening-looking suit. But I don't think that the virtuosos would like to have a critics on their fashion taste in the article XD. Though I'm pretty sure Mr. Veljanov is influenced by his theatre studies not only in the vids but also in choosing the outfits. If we were to ask him questions, I'd really like to know if he thinks his studies had an impact on his music, and how did they influence his style and professional life (or "work life"?) in general (since he really tends to be dramatic and theatrical). And it's not personal question, is it? I think it's a normal, intelligent and to-the-topic sounding question XD : smile2:  


I am a Darkstar
Ok heres what I have done

I have emailed the side line editor and asked for permission to quote or post the entire interview with AV in the many/june/july 99 magazine.. Sideline has posted a link on the english DL wiki bit and its EH answering the questions about the 20YofAV....and how is he every anti- ipod.... noted Mr. Horn..! : surprised:

I also think that a sort of DL family tree should be made for the English wiki bit. list out the characters that have been in DL and such...  Not simply these projects are EH side project yada yada... more like  DL then Estampie, insert link....then Qntal insert link then HV insert link on and on so forth and what not!

  you know??  give the whole gestalt  yes!!

I will be totally dependent on the super star colour-ize team for this.... rabbit fan I am but lost I get when the characters shuffle so.. :-D :-D

I will let you know what side line says when I get the email back... Mod's can I post the magazines response here??

PS I will post the youtube link to have translated by any takers... I know DD has volunteered, but she is tremendously busy...
hey someone has to smash those atoms... :-D :-D :-D

Thank you all for you help with this  It will bombastic and huge and over the top~  just like we like here in America

Snogs to all


I am a Darkstar
Ok update
Bernard from Sideline magazine has given us his blessing naturally he request that we link the article back to the url sideline.com

I am happy to do this but...I dont know how to link the article.... was kinda hoping the mag would have done it for me... alas no magnum opus is completed simply or easily :|

So I guess I need a computer wizard to either show me how to link the handwritten article under a well .... link so that we don't have to type the whole thing out on the main wiki bit to be seen by all??  im sorry im not making sense..

I will have to write out the article either way the magazine is 10 year old!  but I want to have it set as a link  not as open text in the main body of the article...  rabbits are picky picky they are!

I like this article because its Alex talking.. :-D :-D :-D. usually its Mr. chatty Cathy Horn with all the answers!!!&nbsp; : naughty:&nbsp; I <3 you Mr. Horn but do not think this detail has eluded me...I enjoy it rather.... shall I say I am not at all surprized!! : heart2: : heart2: : heart2:

Ps Mr, Horn I hear your garden needs tending... I once grew a 309 pound pumpkin...roughly 150 kilograms...&nbsp; If I were closer I would be your TDG gardener..... I grow a mean Dahlia!! :) weeds while simply misplaced plants : heart2:&nbsp; would be my sworn enemy for you sir!

so this is nice to have his perspective on DL...

whew well back to my real job of wife mother and nurse
catch y'all on Wed.....

my love to all and the magic is certainly in this hole!! right Alice?


I am a Darkstar
“RaBBitFan“ meinte:
I also think that a sort of DL family tree should be made for the English wiki bit. list out the characters that have been in DL and such...&nbsp; Not simply these projects are EH side project yada yada... more like&nbsp; DL then Estampie, insert link....then Qntal insert link then HV insert link on and on so forth and what not! you know??&nbsp; give the whole gestalt&nbsp; yes!!
Great idea!

“RaBBitFan“ meinte:
[...] link the article back to the url sideline.com. I am happy to do this but...I dont know how to link the article.... [...] So I guess I need a computer wizard to either show me how to link the handwritten article [...]
the magazine is 10 year old!&nbsp; but I want to have it set as a link&nbsp; not as open text in the main body of the article...
First of all, I'm not a computer wizard!&nbsp; :wink: However, I know how to link things, that are still on the internet. It's explained right here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Link and there: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources
But handwritten articles? ? ? You really need a wizard!&nbsp; :wink: My suggestion: list the source of the article under the heading „Literature“ like this: headline of the interview, taken from side-line magazine from ... 1999. If you write [http://www.side-line.com Side-Line-Magazine] instead of side-line magazine, the linking is done (not to the original article, I have to admit&nbsp; :wink: ).


I am a Darkstar
sorry, a mistake... please remove this one...
Btw: Why it's impossible to delete ones own post?!?!?!


I am a Darkstar
Hi there, I just wanted to let you know I'm working on the translations (yes, Rabbit, even on the "I love to talk about my daughter" one :angel:) but I'll need someone to look at some sentences, any volunteers? : naughty:
I'm pretty sure we can use the articles from Czech that I translate for the author's website and such, and I think he'll be happy with just linking to the article too.

Rabbit. Yeah, we should write a letter to Mr. Horn and say we'll be happy to make the old house a sparkling palace XD. For free! (Almost, probably accomodation, food and piano lessons would be a nice compensation :angel:). I can help you with growing the plants in case Mr. Horn likes GMO and peas XD. Allright, my knowledge of genetics of plants is limited to 9:3:3:1 principle but hey, at least I know what happens if we don't keep the peas types separated :-D&nbsp;


I am a Darkstar

Glad to see you are surviving the exam gulag!

Yes I will volunteer to look over, and correct if need be your translated article.&nbsp; I would get in writing the authors' permission.&nbsp; one can not be too careful. :|
&nbsp; You can clean his house sister... I hate house work with a purple passion : skully: : skully:&nbsp; peas peas

but garden yes&nbsp; GMO friendly our Ernst is?? really really?
I thought that he was very anti GMO?? isn't that what generators is kinda about?? I could be wrong...please let me know if I am off track here :)&nbsp; I think he was promoting whirrled peas--- : naughty: get it world peace : vampy:&nbsp; rabbits is cheesy

I am going to write to the other unsung members of DL on their myspace pages and ask if we can link their myspace pages on the wiki bit.. I hope they can read english...we will find out!
I wonder if we can link AV and EH myspace pages on the wiki bit??

mods&nbsp; can you facilitate this for us... I am all too happy to write either one of the great ones but I don't want to pester them or usurp your power :-D :-D :-D :-D

2 men can share a house, a car and a bed but 2 men cannot share a rubber ducky!-a Sven-ism

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